About banning

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      Cheating and Banning

      This is a translation of the german topic Cheaten und Bannen. Thanx to eN-t for the translation.

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      I want to say a few things about cheating and banning. I'll refer to Mario Kart Wii but I'm sure it's viable for other games aswell.

      Me and my team spent a lot of time to get the Wiimmfi server up and running. And althogh it's running pretty stable already, the work is not done yet.

      On the original WFC, there were around 1500 to 3000 players online at a time. On Wiimmfi there are currently around 100 players online. Especially for cheaters this new server is a challenge. And I think that the rate of cheaters is higher than usual right now because cheaters usually know much more about homebrew related topics than other players do - and they get to know about the custom server earlier. But I also think that the rate will decrease over the time even if we wouldn't ban any cheaters.

      My Position
      I am sitting on the fence here. Honest players report a lot cheaters with a lot of evidence, but even when I ban the cheaters it's not all right (more about that later on).

      But I don't want to waste my time on such decisions. Every ban costs time — gathering the needed information, deciding, then banning and having a discussion about that ban. And at the same time I have to implement a ban system. Does anyone really think that I like to do this sort of stuff?

      I'd rather just don't give a shit about the cheaters, that's why I play in private friend rooms with people who I know and who I can trust.

      Banning team
      I can't get around developing a ban system. And I have already formed an even smaller banning team. It consists of players who I've known for a long time and who I completely trust in terms of cheating.

      That said, I even did not include one of the main developers of the Wiimmfi server just because I don't know him long enough, although I speak to him every day and I do really think he would be a good choice. In the future I could imagine to make him part of the banning team and also to invite other people for other games. What I want to say is that I've currently got a small team of people who just need to tell me a friendcode to ban and I'll do it, I trust them and that saves me the time and effort to think about the ban.

      The team is communicating about this privately and tries to find a good solution. But please be patient because it can take some weeks to technically implement that.

      By the way: applications for the team will be ignored!

      The Dolphin dilemma
      Banning could be sooo easy: every player and his Wii console have a unique identifier. But there is Dolphin!

      Many players use Dolphin without knowing what they are doing. Every player who uses Dolphin has the same identifier, so that's not unique as it should be. When banning one Dolphin cheater, we automatically ban all other Dolphin players aswell. So if I had to make a decision whether to allow cheaters on Wiimmfi or to ban all Dolphin users, I'd go for the second option. Also because Dolphin has another huge flaw: it's slow.

      Almost all Dolphin users have huge online delay. You don't see that while racing, but we can see that using mkw-ana. At the end of a race, the delay is often at up to 30 seconds! The player looks like he would be driving just normal, but at the end of a race every player sends his own race time to the others and that delay causes the results to be screwed up just like a timer hack would do. This way, the player ends up being in a better place than he actually raced. You could say that using Dolphin is like using an uninteded timer hack. And I personally consider delays of more than one second to be unfair.

      So Dolphin causes a lot of trouble, sometimes because people are using it wrong. So am I not allowed to ban cheaters if they use Dolphin, just because many other legit players use Dolphin aswell? Another dilemma.

      Player "xyz" cheated!
      How to react to such reports? Especially when they come from people who are unknown to me? Should I really ban people just because some random player tells me to do so? Now just think about what would happen if you'd be that person "xyz". Hello denunciation.

      As you can see there is a lot to think about and a lot of stuff to waste time on. I can't be bothered to go through all the cheat report messages. All the time that I'd have to put into that is time that I can't work on the server itself. So at the moment, you'll have to deal with cheaters until we come up with a good and reliable anti-cheat system. Be sure that we don't take that easy.

      WIT: Wiimms ISO Tools
      Verwaltet Plain ISO, WDF, WIA, CISO, WBFS, FST: kann Extrahieren, Erstellen, Patchen, Mischen und Überprüfen

      SZS: Wiimms SZS Tools
      Verwaltet SZS-, BRRES-, U8-, BMG-, BREFT-Dateien uvm.

      PN ohne persönlichen Charakter werden ignoriert. Support-Anfragen gehören ins Forum.
      I use Dolphin, with a custom NAND :)

      I run 60 FPS on lite tracks, but 55 FPS on Koopa Cap and other heavy tracks.
      I don't want to cheat, but i agree that make timer bugs (it's a little cheat :p )

      I'm honest and i just want to play, because my Wii is dead, and with Dolphin i can play Mario Kart Wii at 720/1080p
      Looking forward to this system's implementation.

      People will be able to wait it out, I mean really they have CTGP, and CTs are completely cheat free. And if they really want to regular worldwide, they should pretend it's WFC again, where you found a hacker often in rooms, but you just went to another one anyway or dealt with it.

      Either way this wait will be worth it.

      Aliogeek schrieb:

      I run 60 FPS on lite tracks, but 55 FPS on Koopa Cap and other heavy tracks.
      I don't want to cheat, but i agree that make timer bugs (it's a little cheat :p )

      And that's the reason why you are going to get banned. A timer cheat IS NOT a little cheat. Lets see if I can talk with the Dolphin team to find a solution for Dolphin users.
      Ich gehe nur bei Frauen im Alter von 18 bis 20 die Bettwäsche testen.

      i'll try a global race using Dolphin (and my Wii's NAND, think it is even required for using WFC in Dolphin 4.0) now.
      If it bugs out, I'll go off, in a normal offline race I ran at 60 FPS, so there is hope. :)

      Mii-Name: Zottel
      FC: 2020-1200-2710

      Edit: I didn't end the race as there were multiple slowdowns during the race.
      „A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. LLAP“ – Leonard Nimoy

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 1 mal editiert, zuletzt von max-m ()

      Aliogeek schrieb:

      I run 60 FPS on lite tracks, but 55 FPS on Koopa Cap and other heavy tracks.
      I don't want to cheat, but i agree that make timer bugs (it's a little cheat :p )

      Some mathematics:
      Koopa Cap goes about 3 minutes and your timer is than 15 seconds late. To win the race, it is enough to reach the finish 14 seconds later. And with this knowledge, you drive somewhere in the middle to get good items and you win nearly all races. This is not only a little cheat!

      WIT: Wiimms ISO Tools
      Verwaltet Plain ISO, WDF, WIA, CISO, WBFS, FST: kann Extrahieren, Erstellen, Patchen, Mischen und Überprüfen

      SZS: Wiimms SZS Tools
      Verwaltet SZS-, BRRES-, U8-, BMG-, BREFT-Dateien uvm.

      PN ohne persönlichen Charakter werden ignoriert. Support-Anfragen gehören ins Forum.
      I don't agree with you, banning all Dolphin users is not a good idea. Not all Dolphin users "cheat" with poor hardware.
      I can play Mario Kart Wii with my laptop online at 60 stable FPS, and the game run at 100% speed. I use the latest Dolphin build with default settings. I also tried to play online with my brother (2 players on the same computer), with antialiasing x16, and...4x native resolution of the console. Without FPS drop. And a simple adsl connection.

      @Wiimm :

      Wiimm schrieb:

      Every player who uses Dolphin has the same identifier
      I opened an issue here : code.google.com/p/dolphin-emu/…thanks=7321&ts=1401015354 Seems that you are wrong.

      Wiimm schrieb:

      Also because Dolphin has another huge flaw: it's slow
      Not for everyone.

      Another BIG issue i wanted to report is that if you ban a profile or a console because of slowdowns, this user won't be allowed to play in a room with its friends. I understand that a Dolphin user with a slow computer can be banned from "mondial" races, but not from "friends rooms". Between friends, "cheats" (slowdowns, here) may be allowed in my opinion.

      However, i wanted to thank you for your hard work. Thanks you for your servers, and your custom Mario Kart builds ! You are the best ! :nummer1:

      Blitzur schrieb:

      When u want to play MKWii online buy the console -.-
      man i havte all those post "i got banned and i don't cheat but have dolphin"

      Buy it or don't play it ...
      The Wii isn't sold anymore. Instead there is the "Wii Mini" which just can't load custom ISO like the patched Mario Kart Wii. Just don't cry here when your own 8-years old Wii will die please. Dolphin is a solution in my opinion.

      Blitzur schrieb:

      wow it is so hard to get an wii für a few bucks.
      And whats about the wiiu? there is a vWii and u can play to.

      When u bought the game okay, play on dolphin but when they can't solve that problem i think dolphin will get banned or it would be not fair.
      You are right, not at the moment. But in 2-3 years...
      I don't want to buy a new Wii, and i'm not interested of buying a Wii U (too expensive for 2-3 interesting games).
      I also have a DS with Mario Kart DS, and now i am thinking of emulate this console because i don't have an ISO loader. Which is not legal.
      No one has the right to claim access to the new custom server. It's the administrators' (Wiimm and Leseratte) choice to let people play on it and they can decide just as they please to exclude single players or even a whole group of players from playing on the server. They could even go for a whitelist of people instead of a blacklist. So please stop complaining.
      If they decide to ban Dolphin from the server to create a better, cheat-free experience for console users, then there's nothing anyone could say against their decision.

      So please stop the discussion about Dolphin being so important. It is not the real console, it's often a laggy and buggy troublemaker for online play, bans are easy to circumvent because of Dolphin being poorly prepared for online play and thus of a lower priority. Speaking of that, Dolphin users often neither paid for the game nor for the console itself, they are playing the games completely illegally. And if they own both game and console and one of the two is broken, it's bad luck but still no excuse not to re-buy the game or console. The used game and console are both only a few bucks on ebay so if you want to play Wii games, buy a Wii. Or a Wii U.

      So please stick to the topic here instead of getting into an argument about Dolphin. :thumbdown:
      ModellStandard (weiß, Release-Day)
      Zubehörinterne 500GB HDD, SDHC 32GB, LAN-Adapter, 128MB MemoryCard
      Wi-Fi SpieleWiimm's MKW Fun, Mario Kart Wii, Super Smash Bros. Brawl, ...

      ModellPremium (schwarz, Release-Day)
      Zubehör500GB 2,5" HDD (schwarz), SDHC 32GB
      Wi-Fi SpieleMario Kart 8, Nintendo Land, Sonic Racing (S&ASRT), ...

      Modell3DS XL (blau-schwarz)
      ZubehörSuperCard DSTwo, 4GB SDHC
      Wi-Fi SpieleMario Kart 7, ...

      Was?Code / ID
      Wiimm's MKW-Fun0904-9558-6482
      Nintendo Network IDEnting
      Nintendo 3DS5455-9634-9827

      Danke an feeder für meinen tollen Avatar!
      My opinion on the MKWii via Dolphin argument:

      I've seen videos of people running MKWii on Dolphin on 1080p@60fps on the officlal Nintendo Wi-Fi Connection servers, so one can say it requires an extremely powerful computer to achieve.

      So, I'd say knock yourself out if you have such a computer (Test in a single race first before going online) and stick to a real Wii if you don't.

      Mood: 19 More Years to Super Bowl LXIX, lol.
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