Mario Kart Wii: Wiimmfi Server Update Needed

Rasen · 12. Juni 2015, 01:49

Hello. I know this request is unbecoming of me but, Wiimm your server needs to be updated. People have been disconnecting left and right from CTGP-R (Not effective with DCing) and DCing when loading your Server (Very Effective when dcing). I've disconnected a quite a few times today and a lot of other players have as well. Yesterday I tried racing, that did not go as planned because I dced a lot yesterday. My internet is just fine so I should have no reason for DCing from races. But as for other people I am not sure.

It seems to me that the server needs to be updated. Even one of the racers was showing a message: prntscr.com/7fxxjg
(The name is in-app, I am aware of that lol when that guy got banned)

But please if you have time, or when you can could you do it please? It would help a lot. Thank you!

- From me and a lot of other people who have been effected by the DCing

mjpk2k · 12. Juni 2015, 06:12

Disconnection issues were reported from Momotaro Dentetsu 2010 community, too. Maybe there's something wrong with the server?

Leseratte · 12. Juni 2015, 06:26

Well, before there can be an update of the server (if it really is a server issue) we need to find out what the actual problem ist. And that is difficult because neither Wiimm nor me have those disconnects. We had a friend room match yesterday for about two hours and none of the players disconnected.

NintendoFan · 12. Juni 2015, 06:29

@Leseratte On a similar note, people can't log onto Wiimmfi in Fortune Street or Tatsunoko vs Capcom at all. It throws them 92020, which is a GAMESTATS error.

Astro Star · 12. Juni 2015, 07:42

Leseratte schrieb:

Well, before there can be an update of the server (if it really is a server issue) we need to find out what the actual problem ist. And that is difficult because neither Wiimm nor me have those disconnects. We had a friend room match yesterday for about two hours and none of the players disconnected.

The issue we're seeing worldwides and CTGP is that if too many players join a room at once (2 or more players, depending on the host), the host struggles or fails to negotiate connections and rooms crash. Since you only do friend rooms, Leseratte, you do not see this error occurring. From time to time, we see massive disconnections across all rooms. And, since it is northern hemisphere summertime, activity increases, and so do disconnections. It is especially problematic when livestreamers who stream MKWii experience more frequent disconnections due to the high numbers of players trying to join all at once; rooms can never be maintained under such stress.

Much more often than ever, far more than months prior, the "please wait a moment" screen also takes between 2-5 minutes to load the next screen, sometimes resulting in crashes.

Torran · 12. Juni 2015, 08:18

I doubt I need to report more NAT issues. They're widespread, you can't not find one. And no, these are server issues, not peer issues. It's especially interesting when Wiimmfi reports a different NAT type than what's expected.

To elaborate further, my test cases involved: wireless hotspots, wireless repeaters, virtual network adapters, VPNs, DMZ, UPnP

In cases where instability occurs, NAT type is always reported as 0x6 (Unknown). In reality, the cases that I have setup have perfectly Open NATs, or at least Moderate in some instances. They function perfectly fine with Nintendo Network otherwise. There's no doubt that the NAT type is being reported incorrectly and this may cause issues.

Wiimm · 12. Juni 2015, 08:48

Without concrete details I can't investigate.

I need:
* game
* friend code
* exact time (UTC or CET)
* game stage (entering WFC / matchmaking / playing / ... )

However there was a gamestats issue and @Ciapa restarted the gamestat server.

MrBean35000vr · 12. Juni 2015, 10:23

The easiest way to see the problems in action is to go into a public race of Mario Kart Wii, and have as many people as you can jump into the room at once. Observe the host of the room on the live view, and see what happens to their driving, that doesn't seem to happen to any other racer in the room. Alternatively you can be racing in a public room (and not be the host) and have a ton of people join you, you will also see the host's intriguing driving. When you see how badly the host begins to drive (coming to a complete stop, rapidly snapping ahead, performing drifting and wheelie at the same time, at an input rate of about... one new input every 5 seconds or so?), it's little wonder that the disconnects start to occur. The gory details, I am not clear on, but this was definitely not an issue on WFC. It only really affects rooms that end up with 8 or more people.

Footage must exist everywhere, but would you like us to get ahold of some with proper timestamps, multiple points of view, FCs and the like? I could certainly arrange that.

Wiimm · 12. Juni 2015, 15:47

I'm at home now and played some races in different rooms and can't detect any abnormal behaviour. And MKW-Stats page looks also well.

Then I have searched the providers status page. Since yesterday 22:00 CET he made several maintenance jobs, but no one was network relevant.

The only changes I made was:
NATNEG update at last Sunday: More stats only, but no change of the algorithms.
MS: Update 10-14 days ago: Detecting and stats about the new found message handling (as redirector), but no change in the delivering algorithm.

Leseratte · 12. Juni 2015, 15:55

@Torran the Nat type is always set to 6 - unknown. Even on the official servers. And usage of natneg is hard coded into the game no matter if you need it or not.

Tock · 12. Juni 2015, 16:08

Did you mean @Torran @Leseratte ?

Edit by Leseratte:
Yes. ...

Rasen · 12. Juni 2015, 20:38

MrBean, are you refering to something like this?

prntscr.com/7g79g7
*snapshot taken 5-10mins ago
Time Zone Central USA: 1:20-1:38PM

Leseratte · 12. Juni 2015, 20:48

This bug (two seperate rooms show up as one on the Wiimmfi page) is a game bug which actually did appear on the Nintendo servers, too. But nobody recognized because Nintendo did not have such a status page.

This bug does not prevent you from joining the room, nor does it disconnect anyone.

MrBean35000vr · 12. Juni 2015, 21:03

Rasen schrieb:

MrBean, are you refering to something like this?

prntscr.com/7g79g7
*snapshot taken 5-10mins ago
Time Zone Central USA: 1:20-1:38PM

No, not that, that is a common occurrence when two players decide to take over hosting at once. That doesn't affect rooms in the slightest, it just makes friend joins a little weird.

@Wiimm The problem we're describing is not a recent thing; Wiimmfi has had it since day 1, and you really do need a lot of people to join at once in order to see it. If everyone joins gradually over time, it's typically fine. It's just if there's a massive movement towards one room that it occurs. If you're the host of the room yourself, you won't notice anything except your roulette slowing down (can't mash L to get item faster because not everyone knows you're getting it).

Leseratte · 12. Juni 2015, 21:07

MrBean35000vr schrieb:

No, not that, that is a common occurrence when two players decide to take over hosting at once. That ...

That is wrong.
When you have a global room and two players decide to be host the same time, you got a room split, and every player randomly chooses one of the rooms. This does not cause that bug.

The bug happens because: Whenever you open a room (friend room or hosting a global match), the Wii generates the group ID by calculating "PID + Random Number (iirc beween 1000000 and 1100000)". Because the group ID contains a random number, it might be possible for two complete different rooms to get the same group ID - without both rooms ever connecting to / knowing about each other.

MrBean35000vr · 12. Juni 2015, 21:53

I think actually both are right, I've definitely seen a room divide before, splitting into multiple hosts, and it does cause that bug every time since the room ID doesn't change (I call those rooms duplicate rooms). But, that other method of getting a duplicate room should also be true.

If you ever get a "win disconnect" when nobody else does, check the status page. You will be hosting a room with an identical ID to the one you left until you leave or get the "You were disconnected from the other players" message. If everyone gets a win disconnect, EVERYONE hosts it

It's quite funny.

Wiimm · 12. Juni 2015, 22:06

I a host leaves the race, a peer-to-peer communication starts to decide, who is the new host. The server has nothing to do with it, it is only used as dispatcher to deliver the messages. It's the same method as on matchmaking: The server don't decide anything about rooms or groups. And the Wiimmfi pages only try to interpret the peer-to-peer messages to display the status infos.

Starlight · 20. Juni 2015, 21:57

I agree now this problem : I got DC'ed 5 times in 1 hour ! Some players broke certain Worldwides, deliberately or not.
I remember that on my server i played against a hacker that has the hability to broke the room (disconnect all players).

Billy549 · 20. Juni 2015, 22:46

We are *literally* in the process of bug-testing the new wiimmfi server xD

Starlight · 20. Juni 2015, 23:40

PokemonAcer schrieb:

We are *literally* in the process of bug-testing the new wiimmfi server xD

I come

LukasLoucks · 6. Juli 2015, 20:35

If you want to see what we mean by mass joins causing mass disconnects, you may be able to see it in action right now twitch.tv/mrbean35000vr

From the moment Bean started, mass disconnects have been starting because people are joining too fast. Room goes from 2 to 9 players in one race, players join next race, and then the near entirety of the room gets disconnected. Rinse and repeat until people quit playing on the server and people join slowly (btw, the issue is very unlikely to occur when people join slowly over the course of several races).

This is has been going on since wiimmfi's release last year, and it's getting incredibly tiresome. It is bad because it discourages people from playing since they can't even play a full race in a session sometimes. I think testing and fixing on this should start as soon as possible. My suggestion for testing to see what the issue is is for two people to get into a room on the globe join, have them start racing, and then flood the room up with people. Nintendo WFC was able to handle these mass joins.

If you want to see the past broadcast when Bean is done streaming, it's here twitch.tv/mrbean35000vr/v/6998942

m4xiking · 6. Juli 2015, 20:45

LukasLoucks schrieb:

If you want to see what we mean by mass joins causing mass disconnects, you may be able to see it in action right now twitch.tv/mrbean35000vr

From the moment Bean started, mass disconnects have been starting because people are joining too fast. Room goes from 2 to 9 players in one race, players join next race, and then the near entirety of the room gets disconnected. Rinse and repeat until people quit playing on the server and people join slowly (btw, the issue is very unlikely to occur when people join slowly over the course of several races).

This is has been going on since wiimmfi's release last year, and it's getting incredibly tiresome. It is bad because it discourages people from playing since they can't even play a full race in a session sometimes. I think testing and fixing on this should start as soon as possible. My suggestion for testing to see what the issue is is for two people to get into a room on the globe join, have them start racing, and then flood the room up with people. Nintendo WFC was able to handle these mass joins.

If you want to see the past broadcast when Bean is done streaming, it's here twitch.tv/mrbean35000vr/v/6998942

This is rather a rare case. Disconnects happen because of bad hosts (Dolphins or in common bad connections) among peers.

The server is very stable at the hardware-side, but not already at the software-side as it is not completely based on C but PHP yet.

LukasLoucks · 6. Juli 2015, 21:06

As someone who has played on this server since its release, has played on custom tracks worldwide and regular worldwides, and has been to a lot of these streams for mario kart wii, I can tell you for a fact that the issue is a lot more common than you think. It is not because someone is a bad host. If too many people join a room too quickly, 99% of the time almost the entire room disconnects. It is not because the internet connection of the host is bad. I've seen people with really good Internet connections become host and the whole room gets destroyed. As I said, this was NOT AN ISSUE before the NINTENDO WFC SERVERS shut down. This IS AN ISSUE WITH WIIMMFI.

Leseratte · 6. Juli 2015, 21:24

Today I played many Worldwide races (more than 50) and watched the player count. During those 50 races, I never disconnected, even when there were 6 people joining at the same time.

As soon as the race starts, the Wiimmfi server has NOTHING to do with the match. You could basically shut down the server, make it stop anything and you will still be able to complete that race just fine. If you get kicked when someone is joining, either you or the one who joins has a bad connection, a bad router, is using Dolphin or something else.

Are you using a normal Wiimmfi image / Wiimmfi patcher or CTGP-R? We already had another "issue" on Wiimmfi I suspect CTGP-R on the host's wii being the real problem for that ...

Torran · 6. Juli 2015, 21:25

Wiimmfi sucks at NAT Negotiation. This is not news. Get it fixed.

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